There is always a healthy debate that ensues when people begin considering whether or not new laws should be enforced in the trucking industry. But the debate tends to take on a more robust tone, and sometimes becomes borderline riotous, when the idea of enforcing personal lifestyle choices on drivers becomes the topic of debate. There are a number of trucking companies that have begun to enforce weight restrictions as a hiring criteria in recent years and I believe we’re going to hear a lot more about this in years to come, especially if the economy remains below par and the standard requirements for truck driving jobs remains higher than it has been in the past. The question is, should body mass index be allowed to be a criteria for hiring?
What Is Body Mass Index?
According to the Nutritiondata glossary:
“Body Mass Index is a standardized ratio of weight to height, and is often used as a general indicator of health. Your BMI can be calculated by dividing your weight (in kilograms) by the square of your height (in meters). A BMI between 18.5 and 24.9 is considered normal for most adults. Higher BMIs may indicate that an individual is overweight or obese”
In basic terms, it’s an approximation of how much you should weigh based on your height.
Why Would Trucking Companies Enforce This?
Trucking companies are generally looking to find qualified drivers that strike a balance between safety and cost. In other words, they’re not willing to pay a safe, experienced driver tons and tons of money, but they also can’t afford to put drivers out on the highway that have proven to be unsafe just to save a buck on payroll. Profit margins are very tight in the trucking industry and the reality is you have to find a way to turn a profit. Unfortunately, some level of compromise is necessary to achieve this.
A driver’s ability to make safe and responsible decisions is absolutely paramount in the trucking industry and companies are always trying to find new ways of determining whether or not they can trust someone to make the right decisions when they’re out on the road. Checking a person’s credit score is one way in recent years that companies have tried to determine the character of an individual.
Body mass index is becoming another way for trucking companies to attempt to judge the character of a driver, try to reduce their costs, and increase their efficiency. Generally speaking, and this is where people are going to freak; they’ve determined that people who are quite obese do not have the self-discipline, attention to detail, ability to make prudent decisions, or energy level that someone who takes better care of themselves would have. The image they portray of their company and the higher costs of healthcare associated with their level of fitness is also a detriment to the company.
Is Enforcing Body Mass Index Limits Discrimination?
First, the definition of discrimination from Wikipedia:
“Discrimination toward or against a person of a certain group is the treatment or consideration based on class or category rather than individual merit”
This is one of the arguments people will make against enforcing such rules. They say you can’t discriminate based on sex or race, so you shouldn’t be able to discriminate based on somebody’s weight. I would agree with this assertion if a person being significantly overweight:
- Had no effect on the ability for them to perform their job as well as someone who is in good shape
- Posed no additional risk to those around them when compared with someone who is in good shape
- Posed no additional costs upon their company compared with someone who is in good shape
I think you’ll find it quite difficult, or nearly impossible, to make those arguments stick – the evidence clearly points to the contrary.
I would also argue that if people believe being morbidly obese is a personal choice and they should have the ability to make that choice for themselves, then why wouldn’t a trucking company be given the equal right to hire the people they believe will give them the best chance for success? If a company can prove that hiring drivers who are morbidly obese will negatively impact the company, they should have the right to refuse hiring that person based on that factor alone. It has not been proven that an employee’s race or sex will have a negative impact on a company or on an employee’s performance of the job, therefore neither are allowed to be a hiring criteria.
How Heavy Is Too Heavy?
Make no mistake about it, companies are not talking about forcing everyone to become lean and mean. Not even close. They’re basically talking about eliminating those that most would consider “morbidly obese”. In other words, we’re not talking about an extra forty or fifty pounds, were generally talking more like an extra hundred pounds or so.
A current example would be from Prime Inc where the maximum BMI is 39, which means someone who is 5′ 7″ can weigh up to 250 pounds. The “ideal weight” they list for 5′ 7″ is about 150 pounds.
Should The FMCSA Be Allowed To Enforce BMI Standards?
As you can see, I clearly believe that body mass index should indeed be allowed to be a factor in whether or not a company chooses to hire an individual. The question for me now becomes “Should the FMCSA (Federal Motor Carrier’s Safety Administration) or other government agency be allowed to enforce body mass index standards on the entire trucking industry?”
In my opinion the government should not be the one to enforce these standards on the industry. I feel the companies should be allowed to enforce their own standards on this issue as they see fit. The main reason I feel this way is because the trucking industry is incredibly dynamic. Small changes to the economy can have a massive effect on how many drivers are available for hire. A strong, fast economy can cause a tremendous shortage of drivers, and a big downturn like the one we’re facing now can cause a large surplus of drivers in the industry.
Not only are there large swings in driver availability based on the economy in general, but the ever-changing circumstances within each company can create a large demand for new drivers, or the need to sharply decrease the size of the fleet by letting some drivers go. Swings in the economy, changes by a competing company, the gain or loss of customers, an economic crisis within a company, and a whole range of other factors can have a large effect on the driver requirements within any individual company.
I feel trucking companies are held responsible for their safety by FMCSA enforcement, including the new CSA 2010 Program getting ready to take effect, local law enforcement authorities, and our judicial system. Trucking companies need to retain the flexibility needed to employ higher hiring standards when they have a surplus of drivers available, and lower their standards a bit when a sudden need for drivers arises.
We Want Your Opinion
So how do you feel about it? Should body mass index be allowed as a criteria for hiring within the trucking industry, and should the Federal Government be the one to impose standards, or should trucking companies impose their own standards as they see fit? Leave a comment below to let us know what you think!
yes i have students cant fit btw so how can they drive.
When you say "students can't fit" – do you mean they can't fit into the truck? Or they can't meet the qualifications? Actually, if they can't do one they may not be able to do the other
I don't think it should be allowed my self. I checked mines online and i would have to loose about 70 pounds according to what is considered normal BMI.
I'm 5'7" 220. I can still bend over touch my toes with no problem. If BMI comes in to play i see a lot of pepole out of luck when it comes to getting a job.
Thanks Ed for the input. Keep in mind though that no company would require you to be anywhere near "lean and mean". Even at 5' 7" 220 you'd probably be well within most company's limits even though you're 70 pounds above what is considered "ideal". Now I'm 5' 7" 165 and I'm built pretty well. I'd ideally like to be about 157-160 and that would make me lean and mean. I'd have to dehydrate myself to get down to 150. That would be too light for someone my height with an "athletic build". My weight puts me in the "overweight" category but I couldn't get to 150 with my build and be healthy.
For guys our height they would likely be looking to put the limit somewhere around 240 I'd say. I know Prime Trucking has a BMI limit of 39 – which means at our height you could weigh a maximum of 250 pounds – so you're safely within range. As you can imagine, if you were to put on another 30 pounds from where you're at now…..that would really be a huge difference.
That's exactly the problem with BMI, it does not consider that muscle mass is heavier than fat mass. So a person with say a body fat % of 9-14 (very Lean) will score obese on BMI which only considers overall weight vs height…..
Yes, that's true. I have an athletic build and I'm reasonably strong. I'm at a healthy weight but I'm considered about 10 pounds above what the BMI would call "ideal". I'm also assuming that the BMI calculations are a compromise between men and women because I've never seen anything regarding separating the two for calculations. But with regard to enforcement in the trucking industry, these factors will never be a concern because they're not expecting anyone to be anywhere near the ideal weight. The figures are very, very tolerant and if you were strong enough to be 5' 7" and weigh over 250 pounds while having a low body fat percentage you would make Arnold Schwarzenegger look like a scrawny nerd.
The big question for me is: will the CSA 2010 require a BMI within certain limits? I keep hearing rumors about this, but have seen no 'official' documentation of these regulations on a federal level. I can understand companies setting restrictions on BMI, for health insurance reasons but IDK if I like gov. saying anything about it. A good driver can be 165#, or 350# and still be a good driver. . . what are the CSA requirements?? Are there any? this is confusing!
Hi Becky. That's a great question.
At this point there is no indication that CSA 2010 will contain anything regarding BMI restrictions, or involve setting health regulations of any sort. CSA 2010 will be specifically aimed at keeping track of the safety performance of both truck drivers and trucking companies. They will indeed be tracking failed drug and alcohol tests by drivers and the failure to issue proper testing procedures by companies, but there will not be any actual medical standards set within CSA 2010.
There is also no indication at this point that the government intends to issue any sort of BMI standards or regulations upon the trucking industry. At this point the trucking companies themselves have the liberty of setting their own standards and changing them at any time, but the government is not getting involved in this process at the moment. As with most regulations imposed on drivers, it is quite likely that the insurance companies are the ones encouraging trucking companies to explore setting BMI requirements for their drivers.
Even if this comes into play, I seriously doubt that any trucking company will require their drivers to be as fit as an athlete. I would think that it applies to the drivers who, literally, have belly fat hanging down to their knees and can barely squeeze their big paunch behind the steering wheel. There are plenty of drivers out there who fit that description. When obesity reaches the ridiculous proportions that it has with some drivers, it starts being less an issue of discrimination, and more of an issue of safety and presenting a positive image on the part of a company.
Great points, Rick. I agree 100%. I think the intent of trucking companies that are going to enforce these standards are exactly as you say – to target only the guys and gals at the extreme top of the weight scale. It's just way, way too dangerous to have 80.000 pounds rolling down the highway with someone behind the wheel whose health is extremely uncertain. They won't let people drive who need insulin shots or have Epilepsy for the exact same reason – it's just too risky. And if UPS or FedEx can say you aren't allowed to work there with long hair because it's bad for the company's image then image alone must be legal grounds for a BMI policy.
No way should BMI be used as a hiring determination. That would definitely be discriminating. Companies should only be using criteria to ensure the candidate can safely get the job done. Something along the lines of; Is the candidate able to lift X pounds? Is the candidate agile enough to perform a safety check? Is the candidate able to fit behind the wheel and reach all the controls? … etc. Aren’t those requirements part of obtaining a license to start with?
Anyway, obese individuals already face an uphill battle when trying to get employment. I remember seeing a couple of documentaries in college, or on 60 Minutes, or somewhere, that had these themes; Send two candidates for a job interview that have the same qualifications, only one will be attractive and one will not. Most of the actors they used for the not attractive part were overweight. Guess which ones got the job? The other theme was to place an individual next to a broken down car on the road side. They would use an attractive woman one time and a not so attractive woman another time. Guess which one got the most help? Yep, in both scenarios, the more attractive person got the job or help the majority of the time. While this is more sublime discrimination, it does point out that obese people have a difficult time getting a level playing field. I vote to not pile on a BMI requirement as well.
- Chuck -
Thanks Chuck. No question that good looking people get treated better than not-so-good looking people. I don't think anyone would argue with that. And obese individuals do indeed face an uphill battle in life – with everything they do. But you accidentally defeated your own argument when you said (correctly I may add):
Companies should only be using criteria to ensure the candidate can safely get the job done
I agree. But being very obese is a safety hazard and does prevent them from doing all of the duties of their job safely. What if they have to help load or unload? What if they're down on the ground and have to climb up into the back of their trailer to secure their load? What about the risk of them having a heart attack while driving down the road? What about the extra healthcare costs to the company? I'm going to add the definition of discrimination above because several people have agreed with you that this would be discrimination, but by definition it is not. There is a solid financial reason for using BMI as a criteria.
Hey Chuck – you make some excellent points. I didn't see the show you're referring to on 60 Minutes but I'm sure there's likely several factors that apparently lead to low heart disease in Italy – I can't debate that. But to try to make the argument that highly obese people are not more likely to have health issues that could lead to higher healthcare costs for their company and a higher risk of loss of control at the wheel due to a heart attack or passing out would be quite the impossible mission. To say that "the heart attack argument is just not fair" I can't agree with. It is fair because it's based on medical studies, not prejudice or opinion.
As far as people who can not load or unload but are under the BMI – they do indeed get turned away by companies that require you to be able to do these things – as they should.
And as far as individuals who are not really overweight but smoke, drink, and eat poorly – you're absolutely right – many of them do indeed pose a risk and we've all heard of thin, 45 year old men dying of a sudden heart attack. Being fat is far from the only health concerns for sure and I would run with this point by saying I feel the DOT physical should be more strict than it is in a lot of areas.
I'd like to point out that companies are also using metrics like BMI in hopes of finding safer drivers, drivers who are more responsible and trustworthy, and eliminate as much as possible the glaring problems that could lead to a company facing heavy lawsuits when there's an accident. You also have the idea that a company's image does indeed matter, and being 5' 7" and weighing 270 pounds does not portray the image of a responsible, hard-working person who pays attention to detail, takes pride in themselves and their work, and are serious about success. All of these factors matter to a company.
Certainly you're right – there will almost always be at least some exceptions to every rule. But you have to set standards, you must put safety first, and these companies are doing their best to screen drivers that give them the best shot at success. They're hoping to find drivers that are most likely going to take care of the company's image, customers, and equipment; and to safely share the road with the families around them day in and day out.
Brett,
I understand where you’re coming from and probably won’t sway you, so I’ll try and make this my last post and we can agree to disagree.
I think using a BMI is a slippery slope and this statement you made really scares me;
“I'd like to point out that companies are also using metrics like BMI in hopes of finding safer drivers, drivers who are more responsible and trustworthy, and eliminate as much as possible the glaring problems that could lead to a company facing heavy lawsuits when there's an accident. You also have the idea that a company's image does indeed matter, and being 5' 7" and weighing 270 pounds does not portray the image of a responsible, hard-working person who pays attention to detail, takes pride in themselves and their work, and are serious about success.”
Wow! Are you really saying companies believe that because someone is 5’7”, 220lbs, they are not hard workers, not safe and not serious about success? I can’t think of any statement more discriminatory than that one. I hope I’m misinterpreting what you’re saying.
Every company wants to hire, smart, safe, hard working, motivated people. My point is you don’t, and shouldn’t, use BMI to find those people. There will be certain requirements for any job. You either meet them, or you don’t. If it’s a requirement that you have to be able to crawl under a truck and check brakes, have the person demonstrate that the can do it. If it’s a requirement that someone has to climb up on a truck and secure a load, then have them demonstrate they can do it. If it’s a requirement that a driver log X miles a week, and they’re logging X -Y, then you have a talk with them, put them on a Performance Improvement Plan and let them go if they can’t meet it. Just make sure the requirement is the same for all drivers. If it’s a requirement that someone be away from home for two weeks and they say they can’t because they need a blood transfusion once a week, then you don’t hire them. I know that last one is a little absurd, but you get the idea. Now, all that being said, maybe you find a trend where people with a high BMI have a hard time meeting those requirements, maybe you don’t. However, your measurement was objective and fair. All employees and candidates are held to the same standards and there is no prejudice that a person was fired, or not hired, because they were fat. It was simply a matter if they could do the job, or not.
I like your Trucking Truth site and what you’re trying do with. Keep up the good work!!!
- Chuck -
Thanks Chuck – I'm glad you enjoy the site and I'm enjoying the discussion. You said:
Do you feel that someone who allows themselves to be dangerously overweight and does not even take the responsibility of taking care of themselves seriously will be serious about taking great care of their company, their truck, a company's customers, and most importantly the minivans full of children that surround them everyday on the highways? If they don't even care that they're putting themselves at high risk of dying way too young, and don't care about the suffering that their premature death would bring to their family, friends, and loved ones, do they really care about the risk they're putting the strangers in minivans around them in? The answers may somehow, against all reasoning, be yes. But if you're the owner of a trucking company, you know that getting sued for one bad accident caused by someone who can be shown to be a high-risk driver could be the end of your company. So you're looking for the most responsible drivers you can find. Does someone who is 5' 7" 270 pounds strike you as someone who is acting responsibly?
If you got a call tomorrow that several of your family members were killed when a very obese driver had a heart attack at the wheel and lost control, what would be your first thought? Everyone's first thought would be "Why was a person in such a high risk category allowed behind the wheel of an 80,000 pound vehicle on public highways? If that person was healthy I would still have my family, but now countless lives are forever ruined. Who is responsible for this?" Would you like to deny this and say your first thought would be "Well, my life and the lives of my family members are ruined now but at least that guy was given a fair chance to drive a truck?" Please! And we all know who the target becomes – the trucking company that hired that person. Therefore, trucking companies have to protect themselves and the general public as best they can.
People who are highly diabetic and need insulin shots, and people who have Epilepsy, are not allowed behind the wheel of a truck by law for the very same reason – it's just too risky. You can't take that chance with an 80,000 pound truck and the lives of so many people at stake. Why don't I hear one single person crying "discrimination" for those people? People with terrible driving records or bad criminal histories are not allowed behind the wheel of a truck because they have proven themselves to be irresponsible. Why no cries of "discrimination" for those people? I'll tell you why – because they're too much of a risk and everyone understands that.
If someone who is morbidly obese wants to be given the responsibility for protecting the lives of the strangers around them on the highway, they should first show they're at least willing and able to take responsibility for protecting their own lives and the lives of their own families, friends, and loved ones.
Brett,
I know I said my last post was going to be the last on this subject, but I guess I lied. Sorry about that. Let me also apologize if it appears I’m beating a dead horse on my points.
I appreciate the fact that you want the healthiest person possible behind the wheel of a truck. I would even take it one step farther and say I would like to see ALL persons, regardless of their occupation, be as healthy as possible. I’ll even agree that if you’re a 5’7” 270 lbs. person, you will probably be healthier if you lost a little weight.
However, the minute you start stating that a 5’7” 270 lbs person is not serious about taking care of a company, you are discriminating. You might see that person that doesn’t care about him/herself, so won’t care about the company. Someone else might see that person as someone who puts everyone’s else’s interests, especially the company’s, above themselves.
We talked about his earlier, but a high BMI is not a guarantee you’ll have a heart attack. You just can’t make a blanket statement that someone with X BMI is going to die behind the wheel of a truck. If you start down that path, where do you stop? What about the people who have a fantastic BMI, but a high history of heart disease in their family? Do you let that person behind the wheel of a truck? Also, medical studies are ongoing. I just recently heard that doctors are now recommending you eat eggs, when just a few years ago they were saying eggs are bad for you. Maybe the trucker with a high BMI only eats whole wheat pasta, olive oil and red wine, just more calories than he burns. Maybe that trucker has a cholesterol level that would make a marathon runner envious. Maybe that trucker has a very low risk of heart disease.
I was thinking about this last night. You want to higher safe, motivated, hard working, dedicated truck drivers and I’m on board with that. I contend that if you took the top 10 things a truck driver must do to be safe, motivated, hard working and dedicated, you wouldn’t need to use BMI to find that candidate. I’m willing to bet that there are other, non discriminating, ways to screen for those candidates. I won’t argue that once you put that list out that a lot of people with a high BMI won’t meet it, but that would be O.K., because your criteria was objective and not based on a generalization.
Thanks for listening and let me post!
- Chuck -
I am distressed with the news that my BMI index can possibly end my 15 year career.
I am a female, 5ft 4in. I am VERY voluptuous, I have fleshy hips. I carry considerably more muscle on my back, and thighs than most people.
I have NEVER fit into the BMI standards.
How will I not be descriminated against ???
Will I be required to get a breast reduction to fit into the guidelines ?? Will I have to diet down to the point I lose muscle that is important to the performance of my job ?
I comprehend the importance of a healthy driver behind the wheel. I'm not here to argue that.
I'm raising this issue now. Hoping that someone is listening.
ONE SIZE DOES NOT FIT ALL
Hi ZBrat. I myself do not fit into the BMI guidelines exactly – I'm muscular and would be considered about 10 pounds above "ideal" according to their scale. But the limits that companies are placing are close to 100+ pounds overweight, not 10 or 20. At 5' 4" you could weigh up to about 225 pounds and still be ok. Now you didn't mention what you weigh, which is fine. But I must say – If someone is 5' 4" and weighs anywhere near 225 pounds, they are not robust, voluptuous, big-boned, or any of the other candy-coated descriptions people use. When I was 5' 7" 190 I considered myself fat. People laughed at me and mocked me for my "gut", and they were right. I was always an athlete and had let my weight get out of control after years on the road. If people were mocking a strong guy who is 5' 7" 190 as being fat, what would someone be considered that is 5' 4" 225???
Look, successful people do not live in denial, do not make excuses for irresponsible behavior, and do not call others "discriminating" when they're actually being truthful. Successful people face reality and deal with it head on. I was fat – I faced it, I dealt with it, and now I'm incredibly healthy. And I'm thankful that my friends and family mocked me for what I let happen – they were right. They told me what I needed to know, not what I wanted to hear. I have no idea what you weigh, but if you're anywhere near 225 I'm going to say that it's time you step up and take responsibility for yourself. There is nothing special about me that I could do it and anyone else can not. It took a lot of discipline and I did it. I was on the road and began eating very healthy, went jogging 5 days a week, and had weights with me to tone up. I drove just like everyone else and I did what needed to be done. I hope others out there will do the same.
I am 5'3" and weigh 300 pounds. I've been driving for 12 of the last 18 years. I have over a million miles of SAFE driving. Nope, no minivans full of children have found their way under my trailer!
I can also climb in and out of my truck 10-20 times a day, climb into my trailer from the ground to secure a load, or sweep out the trailer after it's empty. I can load and unload the trailer with a manual pallet jack and restack 45,000 pounds of freight as needed.
Please… I can do the job. My BMI is over 50. I don't drink, I don't have high blood pressure, I don't have diabetes (blood sugar is under 100, it's been tested). I don't do the buffets and I walk regularly. I was just cursed with a certain heredity and body type that has become increasingly unaceptable.
Would you feel better if a skinny drunk driver ran over your family than that sobber obese guy with the heart attack?
Hi Karen. Congrats on the years of safe driving!! Now nobody ever said that people who were over the BMI standards aren't capable of being safe drivers. There are a number of other concerns regarding having such a high BMI that were stated throughout the article, but not the ability to be a safe driver when things are going well.
But I have to say that this:
….is completely false – which is why you're so heavy. You've convinced yourself it's not your fault and there's nothing you can do about it so you don't have to try. Remember, I've struggled with my weight at times also. When I thought I was doing everything properly but still wasn't losing weight I started to wonder if I was "cursed" or something – but nope – I just didn't know how to eat properly to lose weight. Once I figured it out, it was incredibly simple to do and the weight just fell off me – 25 pounds in two months – no exercise necessary.
Over a period of a few weeks, work your way down from about 3000 calories a day to about 1500 calories per day and the weight will fall off you like you won't believe. But you MUST count ALL calories accurately. Every calorie counts. If you'll do that, you'll look much better, feel much better, and you'll never have any concerns about BMI ever again.
No I wouldn't. And your family and friends won't feel any better if you begin having serious health issues (or worse) and you tell them "But I'm cursed". So let's quit making excuses and start taking responsibility – it's so easy I'm tellin you!
It's not torture. Get to 1500 calories a day and just watch what happens. You don't have to trust me on it – just try it for yourself.
i membr when i was youjer & the cb breaks wer a hot item back them & the truck drivers i seen back then WOWEE!hand some & took PRIDE in them selves..& apprerance..as well as the females..
I have seen' drivers'that their bellies overlap a wheel or have their seat so far bck they cant hardly reach the pedals.. what in heck,?? or guys standing out down the block from TA west (old 76) in Ontairo'DOT PHYSICALS $20.00!.. SOSNT THIS READ VERY OFF THE WALL TO YOU"If someone whose is obese to morebly .. high blood pressure possibly of a stroke etc..do you want that truck to be behind your loved ones?Buffest at truckstops GEESH! just give them folks a Pizza tray! Yes it hard to lose weight.. But man people.. get a grip! love yerselves,, when your gut hangs as far down as i have seen In case ya didnt know your pulling ALL your insides down with the body fat intestines.liver, etc..just ask yer dr,out of breath esy? how much fat is encasingyourlungs to actually breath?? your heart? how muccch area it there for it to beat freely..Doyou know? love your families..yer grandkids..
I totally agree – love yourself. And if you can't do that, then consider your family, friends, and loved ones and how they're affected – and they are affected. In an earlier comment, one person mentioned the possibility that morbidly obese people (to paraphrase) "are so loving and caring that they put the good of others first, to the neglect of themselves". They are most certainly not putting their friends, families, and loved ones first. They are obviously not concerned with the affect that the limitations of their poor health and the likelihood of a premature death will have on the ones close to them.
Love yourselves, people. Love those who love you. Step up and take responsibility. And believe me, I come from a short, fat Italian family – our lives revolve around food and family!
You have to change that lifestyle to read "our lives revolve around healthy food and family".
oh Com'on Brett,
We know that the rule on BMI isn't based on wanting healthy drivers. If it was they would be concentrating on smokers first.
Well I'm all for considering "ulterior motives" because after all, very few things are done for anything other than the ability to make more money. I'll consider the idea that there is something else behind creating this rule other than finding healthy drivers, but you failed to say what that ulterior motive might be. I'd be interested in hearing it.
Also, the difference between being morbidly obese and smoking is that smokers do not tend to die suddenly the way obese people tend to from heart attacks. That's the concern – the sudden loss of control of the vehicle. And I do believe that health insurance rates take smoking into account so that is where the company prevents itself from higher healthcare expenses from an employee that smokes.
Hey Chuck. I certainly appreciate the discussion. But I must say that as surprised as you are that I've made some of the statements I've made, you saying:
…tells me that you're not ready to face the reality of how seriously dangerous being morbidly obese is. You're kidding yourself I'm afraid. And this statement:
…I've heard before. It's incredibly noble-sounding – "I'm not totally irresponsible and completely lacking of any self-discipline whatsoever. I'm actually just so loving and giving towards others that I have no time for myself. I'm a martyr." ….and that's completely and totally false and once again reeks of denial. The reality is that being 100+ pounds overweight is incredibly dangerous and irresponsible whether you choose to believe that or not. And you (and everyone else) have continuously avoided my questions about discriminating against Diabetics and Epileptics. We'll just have to agree to disagree and I have no problem with that.